Christianity Oasis Forum

[Netchaplain]

Before the Cross, it was all about man in establishing salvation, but after the Cross it’s all about glorifying God and His Grace, which is all entailing because is includes atonement for all the sin of the believer.

His Grace is most depicted in knowing and remembering that the believer is always fully holy, for holiness is a state of being in our union with Him, but it's in our fellowship with Him that we "work out your own salvation" (Phil 2:12) or develop it to the point of it being visually evident, not “hidden under a bushel”; "Be ye holy." To me this means 'ye be holy or ye are holy' and this is because we couldn't be anything else in His Grace and thus, it's now a matter of "working it out," like solving a math equation which is already completed.

We aren't holy by anything we can do (other than receiving Christ) and Christ's holiness does not admit in degrees--we're holy and saved as one can be and the Spirit is working it out through us to be seen; not to obtain anything but to show what we have (union), as everything is already accomplished ("it is finished"). I believe we are passive in being holy, because it is vicariously imputed, not imparted; but active in living it out, so we're not holy because of what we do, but what we do is because we're holy.

"But if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live" (Rom 8:13). This is one passage I believe describes activity on our part in our words and deeds, as we yield or present our "new nature" (man) to God (Spirit); "but yield (present) yourselves (new self not old self) unto God" (Rom 6:13). The phrase "ye shall live" has the appearance of conditional legalism but to me it's depicting a forgoing situation, meaning that since you, through the Spirit, do mortify the deeds, you will live. This is a place in which only a Christian can be, as we increasingly learn to "put off" the excessive carnality.

As we continue to present, He continues to move or direct us (actively-passive) in our doing, which on our part is what we think, but I believe more so as to what we say and do. As you probably know, the believer doesn't produce the fruit--but "bears it" (John 15:8), as only the Vine produces and the "branch" bears (shows) it.

[clark thompson]

God's grace is something that brings us to Him in a loving relationship.

[Netchaplain]

God's grace is something that brings us to Him in a loving relationship.

Amen CT - His goodness continually leads us to repentance! (Rom 2:4)