Christianity Oasis Forum

[Christnundrconstruxn]

I have posted this in another forum but please understand this is VERY important that my TRUE brothers and sisters in Christ open my eyes to any answers to this IF there is any, so that I may shre them not only with the ones invovled in this but also the ones who instead of helping me find answers JUDGED me and lashed out.

yep that's right I'm asking here cause this topic caused major drama on the other site that my church members use
All I got was judged and tongue lashings but ....no answer.

If I feel led to pray for a woman at the alter it is frowned upon it is the churches RULE yes rule for a same sex person to be the one to pray for them.
And now it has trickled over to the youth and they ALONG with me are confused and they are quite upset, but all that is given is run around, no one can justify why??

I mean just think if it had been this way from the days of Jesus and His desciples they were ALL men
It is NOT that I don't understand the respecting of rules or the need to follow but can ANYONE put any good reasoning behind this that has any scripture to back it up

I just don't understand how it can be for us to decide if one is being pulled to pray or testify to the the oposite sex that it is wrong

PLEASE HELP!!!
Cuc

[Ruthk34]

That is the strangest Rule I have ever heard of. In my whole life in any church I have been to we all pray for those in need of prayer wether they be man or woman. The Bible says to go out and testify to every creature, NOT only man or only woman. If we only pray for those of our own gender then how would we pray for our spouse or children who may be of another gender from us? I would toss that so called rule right out the window and advise the youths to do the same. To withhold prayer for someone sounds like the devils work and needs to be erradicated. GOD would NEVER tell us to Not pray for someone.

Listen to The Spirit of Truth. It seems that it has already planted the seed that it was wrong and that is why you questioned this.

May God bless you and keep you. Amen

[dema]

Pray at home? Pray from a distance? Or pray just the two of you? Or pray at the alter touching?

It is common in many religions, Christian and otherwise, to keep the sexes separate in church. Amish still do it. Moslems do in many if not most locations. There are many others.

I don't agree with it - though I do think that a woman and man should not be alone praying unless the door is open and there is someone right outside that door. Baring one's heart makes the soil fertile for something to happen. I was in a church that was traumatized by having a pastor's infidelity revealed. I really liked that pastor and think the was mostly a good man. His infidelity came from exactly that situation.

When hurting in particular, a woman really wants to be helped and a man's heart really goes out to a hurting woman and he dearly loves being her hero. It makes a situation ripe for problems and precautions should be taken.

But at the alter? At the alter that seems a little dirty minded to me. Maybe more than a little.

[xxJILLxx]

Hey cuc,

Rules rules rules.... Yes rules are meant to protect and we do not like them . I heard a great sermon , here is an excerpt from the notes.

Jesus plus anything, even religion, ruins everything. Jesus is harsh with the religious people because they are wolves who close their eyes to the light, make rules for God, want praise for themselves, and defend their idols. Religious rules are all about the external—not the internal—and raise human preferences to the level of God’s laws. Religion doesn’t help people; it binds and enslaves them. Religious people try to be holier than Jesus, but we’re saved by Jesus’ works, not our own. ~Sermon notes Luke 51

HMMMMMMMMMMM

Lots to ponder there.

Also wanted to add that yesterday i was driving and seen a sign on the church. "If you think its hot here...." I laughed and said to myself WHY? Why do they think that they can use fear to bring people to God? I mean yes we should fear Him but why use fear when all that does is bring them to God for selfish motives now (keep their butts out of hot water), not to mention that they are turning God into their own image of Him as an idol. Why when we can show them just how much He loves them. Is that REALY drawing them to God by using fear? NAHHHHHHHH I'd rather run away from the Nun holding the ruler who is damning me to hell by her human RULES and "holy" high expectations. Let God be God and man be man.


Love ya Brother!

♥Jill

[Christnundrconstruxn]

Thank you both so much for your input!!
This bothered me when I saw and heard it practiced in my church, but last night the youth were told of this "rule" NOT even a request but a RULE of our church
I posted a question of where it came from or if there was scripture to back it up on my facebook page which I knew a large part of my friends list is family or church members.
All I got was tongue lashings of "following the leader" and "not respecting leadership" BUT no one could give any reason or scripture to this.

Ruth I will not show disrespect to the church by not following their rules but it makes me question weather I might wish to look elsewhere for a new church, and this DOES hurt cause I feel this is a very spirit filled church.....most of the time
And I did not mean this to my facebook page as it seems to be taken, I was only curious and wated to know if there were any answers, it was the same when we outgrew our annex, we could no longer hold our dinners in the multi purpose area we had....why cause we outgrew it......praise God right......no only debate and anger, why because the only other space large enough was...the sanctuary......."OH THAT'S WRONG!!!" "you sould not do such a thing in His place of holy works" and "that is a place of prayer testimony and sermons ad such....it is not a diner or kitchen"
My response to all of this was "back in Jesus's day did He choose one tree to eat under and one to preach under??"
"did He choose one hill or home to preach His word and another to eat"
No, no, no and NO just as He preached His word and broke bread in the SAME place why is it wrong for US to do the same, they acted as if we wanted to open a dance club on friday nights with girls and alcohol or something

Dema, yes I agree one hundred percent with your response about being alone, unless it is a family or such then it should be done in the open.......such as the alter, this is the place they are using this rule

though I do think that a woman and man should not be alone praying unless the door is open and there is someone right outside that door.

I think I myself would even go as far as the third person coming IN and praying WITH us in this above thought, where two OR more are gathered.

It just does not make sense to me, weather at the "big house" (the sanctuary) or over in the youth area if it is in front of the whole group what do they think, that two are going to start groping each other or having sex right there!!
It just does NOT make sense.
Just as if it where me and you at the alter and your story and prayer need REALLY touched my heart and I felt the need to come to the alter and lay my hand on you and pray, as long as it is in the public place and my hand is WHERE it belongs (preferably on your shoulder or arm)........that's it!!!
and as for the youth NO pda at the alter period!! then what IS the problem!

Again thank you BOTH so much for your input on this as you both have been very helpful, and I knew this was what I needed to do and even spoke it on my facebook page that I would go were TRUE brothers and sisters would discuss this and not lash out or judge.
Again I love this site and the wonderful people here that know what it is to be a TRUE Christian to each other and not be as this world wants us to be.

God bless you both and all who enter here
Cuc

[Christnundrconstruxn]

Thank you as well my sister Jill.
You know it got me to thinking of how you as well as some other sisters here (dema is another )
that have reached out to me since I have been here and had this been a rule here
I do not want to think of where I'd be
BUT at the same time yes if not careful satan gets his filthy little claws in as has also happened here as well

So there is a little of understanding to this rule but there is a whole lot of blessings I may not have recieved had this been true here (and still recieving)
I am in NO way putting my brothers here down or wanting to belittle ALL they do BUT it has been the women mostly that have given me strength and blessings to continue this rough road
Again PLEASE all my brothers here do not feel I do not appreciate all you have done here for me as well as thesite and others here, it is just that the women I speak of here have reached out without worry of weather I may be a "player" as some thought or that I may be hunting for a mate, NO that is God's will NOT mine and if I meet someone here and it is with His blessings then so be it BUT two of the strongest influences in my life here ARE married....HAPPILY I might add and it has NEVER been about anything BUT His blessings between us . (you are one of those two )
Thank you again
Cuc

[vahn]

Whenever I find myself reading the Word as if it was a "Rule" book .... Three things are happening ... One : Is that I'm reading the WRONG book .... TWO : is that I am reading it with the WRONG frame of mind . And THREE : Is a combination of both plus one ; Put the book down , and come back to it LATER .

Our Lord , The Christ , never gave us ANY rules !! ... Yes . I did type it right . He never "gave" us any rules . But , rather what He always said do this , and don't do that , and do this this way and that , in that manner ... but NOTE , He ALWAYS added ... BECAUSE if you do this will happen , and if you don't , that .... so on and so forth . In other words , He was ALWAYS giving us the TRUTH ,- the way things ARE !!! - , Like gravity , there is absolutely NO rule that we should not walk off our balconies , but there IS TRUTH , that if we DO walk off , unless we are tied to "some" thing , people are going to get the flat version of ourselves .

Now , as far as "church rules" are concerned .

1) .. I am in the habit of - as it is with my household - upon entering my house I take my shoes off . No it has nothing to do with tracking mud , dirt or what have you , it is just a simple habit , many a times I walk in and dont take them off at all . It is a habit that makes me feel "unburdened" , - Take a load off - so to speak , make yourself home .
Now , do have to tell everyone that enters my house to do likewise ? , as to make a RULE of it , "or else" ? Or rather I tell my folks and friends to take their shoes off so they feel comfortable , to make my home their's .

2) .. Whenever I visit my friends , and I am being made aware of certain issues or "house rules" , I am to respect that and act accordingly , lest my presence make the host uneasy , and hence ruin the purpose of my visit .

Prayer , is a VERY , VERY , VERY , (did I mention very ? ) PERSONAL thing , and NO ONE has the right or the ability to "MAKE" me pray any other certain way than that of the one that works for me and my Lord . .....


In Christ , our Lord
vahn

[Christnundrconstruxn]

ahhhh Brother Vahn I knew I could count on your input

Seriously thank you for your input, I told a friend just now at dinner "it is pityful I do not feel the love and understanding of my fellow church members as I do with a bunch of strangers on the internet that are more my brothers and sister than they.
AND BEFORE it is taken OUT of context I do not mean we are strangers in a true sense because you all know more things about me personally than ones I have sat next to for years in the pews.
And it is not because you all are giving the answer I wish to hear but you are answering with honesty and heart without judgement or lashing out

Thank you and I hope to see even more input come
God bless
Cuc

[Ruthk34]

I'd like to thank everyone for their input on this issue too. It gave me another way of looking at this situation.

God Bless

[grandma dolittle]

CUC,
I am astounded by the rule at your church! Christ said where two or three are gathered together ..... he didn't say only men.... Don't get me wrong, I am NOT a femanist... see I can't even spell it!... When I have a burden and I go to the altar to pray, I appreciate prayers of fellow church members, not just female ones. This keeping the sexes apart is ridiclous in my opinion. If two people want to get together, then they are not going to do it or start an attraction at the altar. If they do, then they are not on their knees for the right reasons. I understand the keeping the sexes apart in the ancient times and in some religions today, because in their minds, only men counted and needed to be up front worshiping God. No, I don't think women should teach me, but they should be allowed to have the freedom to worship the same as men do. There is nothing wrong with both men and women praying at the altar. I don't think Christ made Mary and the other women following him sit way in the back as he taught the disciples or prayed with them.

forgive me for ranting, but that rule seems all wrong to me.

[Christnundrconstruxn]

Hello Ruth and Grandma,

Ruth I am glad someone is gaining insight from this and I feel I have had a great Christian conversation about something that confused me, and that was what started ALL of this on my facebook page.
I should have known I needed to bring it to ones that truly know how to discuss as Christians instead of bickering or judging.

Grandma I do not see yours as ranting only someone who is passionate of what they beleive.
And just to be clear it is not one or the other they "strongly prefur" if you keep it same sex and I stress STRONGLY
I do understand the reasoning behind it BUT I also see the possibilty of loosing a blessing at the alter due to being affraid of what "might" happen, consider all our lives being thought out this way....
If I walk in this store or bank it "could get robbed / If I step outside during a storm I "could" get hit by lightning.
But here is my favorite..."If" I play the lottery or enter Publishers clearing house I "COULD" become a millionare
My point is don't let the circumstances rule you

I didn't go to the bank and draw money to go to the store because it was storming and I was wanting to play the lottery but didn't because I didn't go to the bank to get the money to go to the store so I didn't even go outside cause I didn't want to get struck by lightning so I didn't realize I missed the dead line on the publishers clearing house and missed my million dollar entry

As for females teaching I have NO problem with a woman doing ANYTHING she is able, one of my favorite pastors that I like to listen to (I don't very often) is Joyce Myer, I love to listen to her though.

Off topic but I just watched a secular movie that was in 3 parts and the third a woman did what was "against the rules" and joined a club made for men only and she made it
Another of my favs is a two race car drivers (both pushed around and even out by men) sara fisher and Danica Patrick which where 2 of a hand full of women ever to race the indy 500 I watched and rooted for both.

Ok enough of MY ranting
Seriously thank you ALL for your input on this I have enjoyed ALL the input
May God bless you all
Cuc

[Dora]

I just visited a church where women pray for women and men for men. It made me feel uneasy. We are brothers and sisters. Is there someone having thoughts during worship about someone else's spouse? It put me on guards so I didn't fall into sin and the spirit of the room changed.

I tell ya, I am one daughter of Christ who desperately needs a safe gentle touch of a brother. I've been hurt by many men and it will take many men to undo all the damage done. I went to hand a brother his phone back the other day and I had anxiety because he was going to touch my hand. I thought about it and I realized the fear was I feel like I would make him dirty if I touched him. Instead of pulling my hand back quickly so to not allow that small touch, I allowed it and watched his eyes as he didn't cringe or wipe his hands off after touching me. God is using "exposure therapy" to heal me from feeling dirty or lesser than.

With that said the pastor at my church won't counsel me, won't hug me, or touch me because I'm female. Sad. It's sad people can not see brothers and sisters instead of male and female.