Christianity Oasis Member Forum & Chat Room

Posted: **Thu Aug 27, 2009 1:03 am**

Well, my friends, today's step was a big one. Forgiving myself and forgiving others. The lesson stressed the seriousness of forgiveness; particularly how we will be judged by God according to what level of forgiveness we give to others.

This is an issue for me, to be sure. So much so, that I don't think I'm going to address it at this moment. The lesson said to ponder on forgiveness, and that is what I'm going to need to do. Right now, I have a headache, and I really need to get to bed soon, as my grandchildren are here, and will be waking up early. This is not the right time for me to be trying to think about this with a clear head and an open heart. So I will put this lesson on hold until I can give it more thought.

I just didn't want anyone to think that I didn't read Step 4, because I did. I like be accountable to others for staying with this program as scheduled. So, I would like to ask a favor of you all...if you do not see a proper response to this step within a day or two, then please kindly remind me not to forget to do it. I think this step on forgiveness is very important to my spiritual growth. But I just can't do it at the moment.

So, this Step in the program is to be continued...

Posted: **Thu Aug 27, 2009 4:36 am**

That's ok but we are waiting! *laughter*

GBU

Real

Posted: **Thu Aug 27, 2009 7:30 am**

Hey stg, sometimes in the steps you walk upon a stone that is a tad bigger than you thought, so you might want to sit on it before continuing on with the steps, and that is ok. I think this step is one that you definitely need to address before you move forward, as it's a big part of the steps. Forgiveness is never easy, especially if someone has hurt you deeply...but it is necessary, lest you become a slave to the hurts and pain. If you feel you want to continue on with the steps and tackle this one later, that is ok too, but check with the Lord and see what He suggests first.

Hope you got some rest sis.

luv ya

Posted: **Thu Aug 27, 2009 11:09 am**

hi small!

yup this step is a biggie. Let the Lord lead you on this sis. we will be here when u are ready

Gbu sis

♥Jill

Posted: **Thu Aug 27, 2009 1:57 pm**

real...

sis....forgiveness is not an easy one. This seems to be one of the hardest steps. This is because its one of the enemy's tools...and it is cuz it works so well for him. Take your time. Think of what was done on the cross..and why...and that it wasnt done halfway or in vain. It covers all. Its complete and it's truth. Forgiving others comes too....with prayer, with honesty to the Lord, with His help, and the decision to do so, knowing we are all in need of His Grace. Dont give up. This is a tough one. Remember, you can do all things through Christ..who gives you the strength. Praying with ya, girl. love you.

in Jesus,
momo *Halo*

Posted: **Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:51 pm**

*Wave* Hi Everyone!

I've decided to write down what I can for this step...see what you all have to say, but continue on in the steps. However, I will be coming back to this one, until I feel that I have truly forgiven everyone that I can think of.

First, I have a question: Does it count as forgiveness if you forgive someone, and then basically forget about them? For example, I have forgiven my first ex-husband for his abuse of me, but we haven't been together for many years now, and are not involved in each other's lives (except through our grown kids, which is rare). So I don't really think about him anymore. Is that still considered forgiveness? Also: When you forgive someone, is it required that you go to them in person and tell them that you forgive them? I don't always do that, and in some cases, if I did tell them, then it would be thrown back in my face, or laughed at, or the sin denied.

Okay, now...my first issue (and only one at this point), with forgiveness has to do with my parents. I caused them a lot of grief, sadness, and worry while I was growing up. But I didn't realize how truly awful I was until I had children of my own, and began to understand the other side of the coin. Since then, I have apologized to my mother on numerous occasions for the way I acted when I was younger. I don't think I've ever come right out and asked her for forgiveness, but I have told her how sorry I am for my past behavior.

However, I believe that I have a problem with me forgiving my parents. They were the first people that popped into my mind as I was reading through Step 4. You see, every time I've made a mistake in my life, and even now, my parents make me feel extremely bad about it. My dad no longer comes right out and calls me names anymore, but he still asks me uncomfortable questions. Like, "Why did you do that?" or "What were you thinking?" or "You're going to have to do this or that..." and the list goes on. When my mom gets upset with me, she sighs and makes other noises of disapproval, or, the last time she was angry with me, she had to get off the phone because she couldn't talk to me any longer at that moment.

When I sin, usually by being irresponsible with money, or by not holding down a job, I already feel guilty and bad about it. If I must tell my parents about what I've done, then I just dread it. I will put off telling them for as long as possible because I just can't deal with their disapproval of me. I have been a huge disappointment to my parents for all of my life. Including presently.

Maybe my unforgiveness towards them is selfish...I don't know. But I feel that they've rarely given me any encouragement. Only when I am behaving in a way that they approve of, do I get any kudos; and even then, it's a guarded approval...like, "Well, she's doing good now, but how long will it take her to screw this up?" My parents never talked to me about life while I was growing up. Like the time when my mom found out that I had lost my virginity at age 14...only then did she decide to give me a talk about sex!

I just don't know how to approach this issue. I feel like I have changed. I am far from perfect, and am barely surviving, but I try to love and support my family members as much as I can. I don't drink or have sex anymore; I haven't lived in sin with a man for over five years. I rarely curse or use bad language; and I genuinely care about the welfare of others. But I don't think I have changed in my parent's eyes very much at all. I'm 43 years old, and I still feel like a kid around them! And, in all those 43 years, I still haven't managed to win their approval.

*Sigh* This is very complicated for me, and it is really the only issue of forgiveness that I can think of at the moment. I'm sure there will be other forgiveness issues from my past that will crop up sometime, but this one with my parents is deep-rooted, and I don't know how to deal with it. Talking to my parents is difficult. I've already tried several times with my mom, but she is still staunchly holding on to the hurt I've caused in the past. My parents are very conservative in nature, and they don't bend easily. They are Catholics, and sometimes I get the feeling that they don't believe that they've done anything wrong. My mom keeps saying that they are "good" people. I understand somewhat about the backgrounds they came from, which makes them the way that they are. But it's just strange for me to have parents that are so distant from their children emotionally.

Sorry this was so long, my friends, but at least now I have gotten this out into the open. I don't have a plan yet on how to deal with this, but perhaps I will get some insight as I work through the program. Speaking of which, I am on to Step 5 tonight, so I will be back in this forum again!

*FriendsLaugh*

Blessings to Everyone...

Posted: **Thu Aug 27, 2009 11:37 pm**

Hey stg sis,

I'm going to begin by answering your questions. Yes it does count as forgiveness if you forgive someone and don't think about them. I do the same with my ex, but I have forgiven him and actually hope to see him in Heaven some day. But...I don't think about him anymore because he is part of my past...not who I am today.

No you don't have to go to a person and tell them that you forgive them. In fact this might hurt them if you do. Best to forgive them and let it go. Sometimes you will have the opportunity to restore your relationship with them and sometimes you won't, but if you've let it all go then you won't feel the emotions of hurt or pain when you think of them.

Now, let's talk a bit about your parents. There is some serious hurt and pain there on your behalf. You've got to begin letting go of everything they say to you...including the things they've said in the past. Just remember what other people say about you...does not define who YOU are. Only God defines who you are, when He is in control of your life. So when others start saying things to down you or hurt you...just know that God knows the Truth. So what you've messed up a lot in your worldly life...God wants you to work on your Spiritual life with Him, because one day the old world will pass away.

luv ya sis

Posted: **Thu Aug 27, 2009 11:55 pm**

Hi smalltowngirl,
When reading your post, I could relate because my parents were also Catholic (although they never went to church) and I never seemed to do anything right and no one ever seemed happy in our house. Getting hit, being ignored, having to care for my younger sisters, my parents drinking too much...

How was I able to forgive them? I realized that it was there problem and so I prayed for them. God helped me realize that they didn't know better, that they were following what their parents did to them. I then forgave them in my mind (I didn't have to do it to them personally)

The other thing that happens when we grow in the Lord is that we die to ourselves. That means we let go of things of the past to make room for new things. That old stuff was no longer there making me hurt so when they would say something to the "new" me, it just didn't bother me any longer because I was a better person and they were who they were.

My Mom became ill and apologized to me for all the wrong she had done. I told her that I had already forgiven a while ago, couldn't she tell. She said she felt she still had to tell me. I think she felt better hearing me tell her that I forgive her.

God had me witness to her, which I had to do over the computer since her voice box had to be removed. She died a couple of months later. I know there were people she swore she would never forgive but I also know that she is in heaven because she accepted Jesus before she left.

Oh yea, don't forget to forgive yourself because you are now a new person and God has plans for you!

Posted: **Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:19 am**

Hello smalltowngirl

I agree with mlg, you don't have to have a relationship with them now. Sometimes it's best to move on. You don't have to let them know you forgive them.

There seems to be a lot of judgement being passed back and forth between you and your parents. Let God be their judge and don't allow them to judge you. You remember as a kid you might of said things like, I'm rubber and you're glue or you have an invisable shield that doesn't let someone elses words get to you. Same thing applies. Don't let those words enter so deeply they wound. Let them fall to the ground. After all, it doesn't matter what they think. It's what the Lord thinks that truely matters in the end.

No matter what you've done you can not loose Gods approval of you. He's the one who's love is perfect. Unconditionally, he loves you. No matter what you have done or will do. You know what, he already knows what you are going to do today to mess up, and he loves you anyway. Because he sees not the error but the child he loves so dearly.

When a human has fallen from the understanding of how great Gods love and forgiveness is, they can begin to judge others and say things that are not uplifting. We are human. We fall to the flesh daily. When they say those things, turn right to God and let him have them, remind yourself of how he approves of you.

I encourage you to keep seeking forgiveness towards your parents. And pray for them. Sometimes we expect God to treat us the way our parents have. We forget His love is pure and their love can never compair to his.

This is Gods love:
1 corinth 13:4Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. 8Love never fails.

It is his will for you to forgive your parents so you don't carry this heavy burden. After all it really doesn't hurt anyone but yourself when you don't forgive them for what they've done. Let go of the past and begin anew.

God loves ya and so do I!
*hug*

Posted: **Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:49 am**

heya smalltowngirl *hug*

I agree with what the other girls have said here and just wanna add something. I dont know why the Lord is leading me to tell you about this, but maybe it will make sense to you.

As you know, i have 3 sons. During the years we often had one or two boys staying with us. Some stayed for a few weeks till they went back home and others stayed longer..til they were finished with school, had jobs and moved on. There was one young man who sticks out in my mind till this day. He was one of those who really struck a chord in my heart. His mom had died of a drug overdose when he was 3 and his dad was in prison for manufacturing drugs. On several occasions his dad wrote to him, telling him not to end up making the same choices he had, that he could have a different life.

From the time he was 3, however, whenever this child made a mistake or didnt measure up to their expectations, knowing this kid's family history, the various people he stayed with often told him he would end up just like his dad. By the time he came to live with us he was almost 17. He was in school, trying to finish, trying to work, but found it so hard to get those voices out of his head...the ones who hounded him every day about who he was because of where he had come from. We used to talk every night..sometimes all night about who the Lord was and how he wasnt defined by the people in his life, but by Christ in him.

I wish i could say that he was finally able to turn a deaf ear to those lies the enemy kept whispering to him, but he could never quite grasp or accept the fact that just because some around him told him who they thought he was, it didnt make it true. The choice was his...as tough as it was, it was his choice to seek out who the Lord said he was. The young man is in prison now...but I dont believe he will be there forever. The Lord will reach him in His time...but if he would only seek how Christ sees him he would be free.

As for forgiving.....when you understand that those people do not define you, that they are just as human and fallable as everyone else, it makes it easier to forgive. There was someone in my past I knew I had to forgive, but had no idea how to do so. As i prayed and cried out to the Lord for help in it, the Lord asked me....did i really want them to pay in Hell for eternity for the things they had done...for eternity. Ask yourself those things. Think of what was done to Christ on the cross....though those things in our pasts hurt us very deeply and have left open wounds, only the Lord can heal those...when we give it all to Him. Choose to release them as Jesus did...and let the Lord deal with them and their hearts. As you learn to release them, He is healing you. When the hurt and past comes back up, give it to the Lord again and say to your spirit its all forgiven and in the past and i wont hold on to it anymore.

You arent alone in this, sis. One day, one step at a time. Bringing all of this into the light of Jesus is healing. Truth will set you free.

love ya, sis
in Jesus
momo *Halo*

Posted: **Fri Aug 28, 2009 11:54 am**

Girlfriends...thanks for all the great replies *hug*

Yes, I will try to forgive them. It is hard. I will try to pray for them more often too, because they are firm in their Catholic beliefs. My mom thinks that good works can get you to Heaven. She believes that simply being a good person counts for something. I don't disagree with this completely, but good works are only of value after salvation...not as a means to it. Good works are fruits of the Spirit. I have discussed my new beliefs with my mom several times, but I cannot win in the end. She always has a comeback for everything I try to explain to her.

I really appreciate the sharing all of you did with me. I'm glad to know that I am not alone. And I do know that I am forgiven of my past sins, and whenever I am criticized by others, I remind myself of this fact. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. It depends who is doing the insulting and what is being said. Even if I know without a doubt that I am okay with God regarding the issue at hand, a twinge of hurt still comes with attack.

Thanks again, and God bless all of you. Have a great weekend, my friends!

Posted: **Fri Aug 28, 2009 12:14 pm**

stg my sister, I too will keep your parents in prayer, that the Light of Truth will shine upon them, that they will see that Jesus is the way, the Truth and the Life and no man comes to the Father except thru Him. Never give up Hope on them sis, because all God asks you to do is plant seeds. Even if your mom has a comeback, don't worry God can handle those...you just continue laying down seeds of Truth to her.

I'm glad you are finally ready to take the steps needed to forgive. You are beginning to grow sis. Yes the enemy is going to try and throw attacks your way, but just know that God is greater than the enemy.

luv ya