Christianity Oasis Forum

[br.dennis]

In Shane Claiborne's article titled: "What if Jesus Meant All That Stuff," he quotes important study results about Christians.

A recent study showed that the top three perceptions of Christians in the U. S. among young non-Christians are that Christians are 1) antigay, 2) judgmental, and 3) hypocritical.

This might explain why membership in the Christian churches are in decline. There appears to be less decline in the historical mainline churches such as Greek Orthodox, Catholic, and Anglican/Episcopal churches. There is also a significant shift towards meditation and Yoga and other spiritual paths that are less dogmatic.

I find these perceptions troubling because they are not at all what Jesus taught and they are not what we are about as Christians. It is even more troubling that these are the perceptions of young people who may be looking for a spiritual home and are staying away of the Christian church because of these perceptions.

So, what can we, as Christians do to change these misguided perceptions of what it is to be a Christian?

d.

[realtmg]

The Holy Bible (J,B.Phillips} translation in which God enlightens me; via His Word and not through "books"states:

2 Timothy 3: 1-7
1-5 But you must realize that in the last days the times will be full of danger. Men will become utterly self-centred, greedy for money, full of big words. They will be proud and contemptuous, without any regard for what their parents taught them. They will be utterly lacking in gratitude, purity and normal human affections. They will be men of unscrupulous speech and have no control of themselves. They will be passionate and unprincipled, treacherous, self-willed and conceited, loving all the time what gives them pleasure instead of loving God. They will maintain a facade of “religion”, but their conduct will deny its validity. You must keep clear of people like this.

6-7From their number come those creatures who worm their way into people’s houses, and find easy prey in silly women with an exaggerated sense of sin and morbid cravings—who are always learning and yet never able to grasp the truth.


I do not discuss "religion" on this site as we all come from different beliefs and backgrounds in which could cause division and strife. I try to focus on LOVE and CHRIST and the relationship I have with him.
It's not how well you know the Bible or how many books one reads but how well one knows HIM.

1 John 4:1 "Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world." NIV

I am saying that books can lead people to think/guide them in any direction of authors choosing.
But, God's Holy Word is Truth and the Holy Spirit confirms it being sought by prayer and a humble spirit.

The end of time is drawing near.The last two statements Jesus made in Matthew were:

Matthew 28:19-20

New International Version (NIV)

19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

In Christ Love,
Real

[br.dennis]

The article that I refer is not a "book." It is a commentary. Shane Claiborne is a highly respected young ecumenical Christian who has begun a Christian Community devoted to serving the poor in urban areas called The Simple Way. He is highly regarded on the global scene of Christianity and is, in the opinion of many, doing important work.

This posting page is titled "Called Christians" and from it's description is devoted to discussion about what it means to be called as a Christian. I think it is important to understand how the world is perceiving our faith, which we all love so much. This posting is not meant to divide anyone, it is meant to educated and inform about how the world sees us. The three perceptions of young non-Christians in the U.S. listed above are certainly not what Jesus taught. If we as Christians are being perceived as bigoted, judgmental, and hypocritical, I think it is important to be aware of it because these are the kinds of issues that keep people away from embracing Christianity in their lives.

[dema]

Be different. Don't be ashamed to be both fallible and Christian. Admit to both faith and faults. And show joy.

[realtmg]

I agree.
The New Age Movement is growing cult that could be mentioned.
The Scripture has been so compromised to tickle one's ear in many Churches today.
This is why I mentioned in the latter days Perilous times shall come.
So I keep it simple by Christ's love for us and His Resurrection.
Many Christians that call themselves Christians are not true Christians. I am not the Judge but I look at the fruits and lives of some of them who say they are.
Yes, it is sad but true.
Joy will come and go as as trials and temptations.
David goes through this throughout the Book of Psalms.
I go there when I experience the the same.

In Christ love,
Real

[br.dennis]

Are you referring to The Simple Way as a "new-age cult?

I would encourage you to read the article. It flushes out some important questions for us to as ourselves.
Here is the article by Shane Claiborne:

To all my nonbelieving, sort-of-believing, and used-to-be-believing friends: I feel like I should begin with a confession. I am sorry that so often the biggest obstacle to God has been Christians. Christians who have had so much to say with our mouths and so little to show with our lives. I am sorry that so often we have forgotten the Christ of our Christianity.

Forgive us. Forgive us for the embarrassing things we have done in the name of God.

The other night I headed into downtown Philly for a stroll with some friends from out of town. We walked down to Penn's Landing along the river, where there are street performers, artists, musicians. We passed a great magician who did some pretty sweet tricks like pour change out of his iPhone, and then there was a preacher. He wasn't quite as captivating as the magician. He stood on a box, yelling into a microphone, and beside him was a coffin with a fake dead body inside. He talked about how we are all going to die and go to hell if we don't know Jesus.

Some folks snickered. Some told him to shut the hell up. A couple of teenagers tried to steal the dead body in the coffin. All I could do was think to myself, I want to jump up on a box beside him and yell at the top of my lungs, "God is not a monster." Maybe next time I will.

The more I have read the Bible and studied the life of Jesus, the more I have become convinced that Christianity spreads best not through force but through fascination. But over the past few decades our Christianity, at least here in the United States, has become less and less fascinating. We have given the atheists less and less to disbelieve. And the sort of Christianity many of us have seen on TV and heard on the radio looks less and less like Jesus.

At one point Gandhi was asked if he was a Christian, and he said, essentially, "I sure love Jesus, but the Christians seem so unlike their Christ." A recent study showed that the top three perceptions of Christians in the U. S. among young non-Christians are that Christians are 1) antigay, 2) judgmental, and 3) hypocritical. So what we have here is a bit of an image crisis, and much of that reputation is well deserved. That's the ugly stuff. And that's why I begin by saying that I'm sorry.

Now for the good news.

I want to invite you to consider that maybe the televangelists and street preachers are wrong — and that God really is love. Maybe the fruits of the Spirit really are beautiful things like peace, patience, kindness, joy, love, goodness, and not the ugly things that have come to characterize religion, or politics, for that matter. (If there is anything I have learned from liberals and conservatives, it's that you can have great answers and still be mean... and that just as important as being right is being nice.)

The Bible that I read says that God did not send Jesus to condemn the world but to save it... it was because "God so loved the world." That is the God I know, and I long for others to know. I did not choose to devote my life to Jesus because I was scared to death of hell or because I wanted crowns in heaven... but because he is good. For those of you who are on a sincere spiritual journey, I hope that you do not reject Christ because of Christians. We have always been a messed-up bunch, and somehow God has survived the embarrassing things we do in His name. At the core of our "Gospel" is the message that Jesus came "not [for] the healthy... but the sick." And if you choose Jesus, may it not be simply because of a fear of hell or hope for mansions in heaven.

Don't get me wrong, I still believe in the afterlife, but too often all the church has done is promise the world that there is life after death and use it as a ticket to ignore the hells around us. I am convinced that the Christian Gospel has as much to do with this life as the next, and that the message of that Gospel is not just about going up when we die but about bringing God's Kingdom down. It was Jesus who taught us to pray that God's will be done "on earth as it is in heaven." On earth.

One of Jesus' most scandalous stories is the story of the Good Samaritan. As sentimental as we may have made it, the original story was about a man who gets beat up and left on the side of the road. A priest passes by. A Levite, the quintessential religious guy, also passes by on the other side (perhaps late for a meeting at church). And then comes the Samaritan... you can almost imagine a snicker in the Jewish crowd. Jews did not talk to Samaritans, or even walk through Samaria. But the Samaritan stops and takes care of the guy in the ditch and is lifted up as the hero of the story. I'm sure some of the listeners were ticked. According to the religious elite, Samaritans did not keep the right rules, and they did not have sound doctrine... but Jesus shows that true faith has to work itself out in a way that is Good News to the most bruised and broken person lying in the ditch.

It is so simple, but the pious forget this lesson constantly. God may indeed be evident in a priest, but God is just as likely to be at work through a Samaritan or a prostitute. In fact the Scripture is brimful of God using folks like a lying prostitute named Rahab, an adulterous king named David... at one point God even speaks to a guy named Balaam through his donkey. Some say God spoke to Balaam through his ass and has been speaking through asses ever since. So if God should choose to use us, then we should be grateful but not think too highly of ourselves. And if upon meeting someone we think God could never use, we should think again.

After all, Jesus says to the religious elite who looked down on everybody else: "The tax collectors and prostitutes are entering the Kingdom ahead of you." And we wonder what got him killed?

I have a friend in the UK who talks about "dirty theology" — that we have a God who is always using dirt to bring life and healing and redemption, a God who shows up in the most unlikely and scandalous ways. After all, the whole story begins with God reaching down from heaven, picking up some dirt, and breathing life into it. At one point, Jesus takes some mud, spits in it, and wipes it on a blind man's eyes to heal him. (The priests and producers of anointing oil were not happy that day.)

In fact, the entire story of Jesus is about a God who did not just want to stay "out there" but who moves into the neighborhood, a neighborhood where folks said, "Nothing good could come." It is this Jesus who was accused of being a glutton and drunkard and rabble-rouser for hanging out with all of society's rejects, and who died on the imperial cross of Rome reserved for bandits and failed messiahs. This is why the triumph over the cross was a triumph over everything ugly we do to ourselves and to others. It is the final promise that love wins.

It is this Jesus who was born in a stank manger in the middle of a genocide. That is the God that we are just as likely to find in the streets as in the sanctuary, who can redeem revolutionaries and tax collectors, the oppressed and the oppressors... a God who is saving some of us from the ghettos of poverty, and some of us from the ghettos of wealth.

In closing, to those who have closed the door on religion — I was recently asked by a non-Christian friend if I thought he was going to hell. I said, "I hope not. It will be hard to enjoy heaven without you." If those of us who believe in God do not believe God's grace is big enough to save the whole world... well, we should at least pray that it is.

Your brother,

Shane



Read more: Shane Claiborne - Letter to Non-Believers by Shane Claibourne - Esquire http://www.esquire.com/features/best-an ... z2LqrhfUMQ

[realtmg]

No,
I was not referring to your article you posted at all.
Sorry you took it that way.

Real

[dema]

Dennis, you are preaching to the choir.

Satan roams around as a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour. How may he devour Christians? Through the very techniques that he is using. People who want power enter Christianity for the sake of the power. People who want to voice anger enter into various religions in order to voice anger. Anything good and beautiful is perverted by the evil one. Certainly child sexual abuse should be an example so extreme that the perversion of Christianity is no shock.

God is love. We will never all agree as long as there is free will. But we can love each other. They will know we are Christians by our love.

We are one in the Spirit
We are one in the Lord
We are one in the Spirit
We are one in the Lord

And we pray that our unity may one day be restored
And they'll know we are Christians by our love, by our love
Yeah, they'll know we are Christians by our love

We will work with each other
We will work side by side
We will work with each other
We will work side by side

And we'll guard each man's dignity and save each man's pride
And they'll know we are Christians by our love, by our love
Yeah, they'll know we are Christians by our love, our love
By our love, our love, by our love, our love, by our love, our love
By our love, by our love, by our love, our love



Read more: JARS OF CLAY - THEY'LL KNOW WE ARE CHRISTIANS BY OUR LOVE LYRICS

[br.dennis]

My original question in regard to this disturbing information was "What can we do as Christians to change these misguided perceptions about Christians. That was the whole point here, which seems to have gotten lost.

[Dora]

Tell us plz.....

[mlg]

Hello,

My answer is simple...yet all that is needed...we as a Christian family need to love them like Jesus...Agape conquers all...

[br.dennis]

I agree mlg. We need to simoly live the Gospel message of unconditional love and radical forgiveness. To change those three perceptions, we would do this:
1. Not be anti-gay and welcome all people including our gay brothers and sisters as equal, because that is what Jesus would do.
2. Not be judgemental, as judegment is God's work, our is something different...to love.
3. To not be hypocritical. If we call ourselves Christians, we need to live our lives according the the teachings of Jesus...unconditional love and radical forgiveness.

d.