Christianity Oasis Forum

[merendarrin]

The stepping stone today seemed much heavier than even understanding God's grace. Though it is sometimes easier to forgive others than ourselves, other times it is easier to forgive ourselves than to forgive others. Some of us like to hold other people to higher standards than we hold ourselves. But, in truth, I don't think we are then forgiving ourselves, but merely burying the guilt and pretending that it isn't there. We like to wear so many masks, and one is the self-righteous mask.

It is so easy to read that we are to forgive, and easy to understand how to do so. I personally find forgiving easy, but the forgetting a little more difficult. It really hit me hard though, when the study said that we get to define forgiveness ourselves, and our definition is what God uses against us! Dang it! Why can't He just overlook that part? Still, what a motivation to forgive! As the study says, we want God to forgive ALL, and there are no levels of ALL. ALL is ALL. I really want to evaluate my level of forgiveness to that I can get all of the forgiveness that I need!

Sometimes we hold on so tight to those feelings of guilt, like it makes us better. (A better martyr?) In fact, it's just a lie from Satan meant to keep us down, from enjoying the victory that we have in Christ Jesus. This study is definitely an example of something that is much easier to say that it is to do. God help us ALL!

Thanks for all of your kind replies. They have been a real encouragement and source of joy for Mere and I.

Meredith and Darrin

[mlg]

Hey Darrin and Meredith,

So off we go on the step that discusses forgiveness. Interesting how we want to be forgiven and often want to forgive others...yet we hold back cuz we let anger overcome us and we want to justify our hurt by holding back on the forgiveness. Imagine if God did that to us. We'd be in an even bigger mess than we already are for sure.

So we learn as Jesus did...suffer wrongfully...love...forgive and let go.

Something we all can continue to work on, for sure.

luv both of ya

[Dora]

Hello Darrin and Mere

This step can be a difficult one, even for the well seasoned Christian.
Your journal has been an encouragement to me to search my own heart to see where are areas I need to forgive.
Oh my, I just realized I'm setting here grumbling to my spouse about someone. I think I need to take your advice and forgive quickly.
It's not easy to do is it? We want justice. We want people to know they hurt us. The peace God gives when we forgive is worth letting down our wants.

God bless you both and keep you close.
May He forever be the center of your relationship.

[momof3]

hi Darrin and Mere

Forgiveness...wow....it is a tough one. I remember one time meditating over the Lord's prayer and when i thought about. "forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us" whew....if He forgave us with the same amount...forgive us just as we forgive others, to the same degree.....that's an eye-openner. He gives us the spirit of love..and with that, the spirit of forgiveness. I believe that He also gives us the power and strength to forgive, and it starts with a decision to do so.

We have been forgiven for so much....and He remembers it no more. If we could just grasp that. If He remembers no more....what does He give us the strength to do if He commands us to do so? We are equipped by a God who understands flesh and gives us what we need to that which He calls us to do.

God bless you both and its been awesome taking this walk with you!

in Jesus,
luv momo

[comfy]

"just as we forgive others," Mom says.

One thing I think of is that prayer starts with "Our Father", though > with the attention to our Father, not first to our sins. So, then, if we have gotten with God, first, we are in His love assuring us so we are able to accept forgiveness and encouraged to forgive others fully in love and caring for others we forgive and praying God's blessing to them, not just letting them free about wrong things they have done, but also seeking and desiring for them to be blessed with God's love and that we fully love them. But if in prayer our attention is first to our sins, or to other people's sins . . . uh-uh . . . this does not work very well. "Have your fill of love with God, first."

The stepping stone today seemed much heavier than even understanding God's grace.

But God's grace is not just something to understand. God's grace is God's love acting in us to make us how God's love is so we are forgiving generously and warmly caring for the person we are forgiving > or else our "forgiving" is merely a *legal* kind of a thing.

Though it is sometimes easier to forgive others than ourselves, other times it is easier to forgive ourselves than to forgive others. Some of us like to hold other people to higher standards than we hold ourselves. But, in truth, I don't think we are then forgiving ourselves, but merely burying the guilt and pretending that it isn't there. We like to wear so many masks, and one is the self-righteous mask.

> > > good point about how if we aren't forgiving others, how can we really be forgiving our own selves?

I personally find forgiving easy, but the forgetting a little more difficult.

Like I'm offering > if our forgiving is just a clearing someone and letting someone off the hook, this can be *too* easy > just a "work" with no real investing in loving that person > just being concerned about our record, instead of most of all how we get into God's love and His kingdom more. I would say we aren't supposed to forget, but invest in loving the person, in spite of what we remember.

We should get a fresh start and give others a fresh start with us, but I believe in remembering things so we can learn from our own past errors and be aware of how we can give in to sinning, and be aware how others can go wrong, also. And take responsibility for testing if and how the person is ready to be trusted > not to trust blindly, after merely "legally" letting someone free of what the person has done. We ourselves, also, need to be tested about if and how God wants us to be trusted. Being forgiven does not mean I am ready to be trusted; so I think I need to be trustworthy by welcoming others the make sure with God about me. Dishonest people will want you to forgive them, then ignore what you've done and trust them unquestioningly . . . so they can keep on with their wrong stuff.

But also it is not really forgiving if I let someone free and then am not interested in sharing with that person. Jesus forgave us, on the cross, in order to have us become Family with Him as our Groom. So, just pardoning someone is not enough.

we want God to forgive ALL, and there are no levels of ALL. ALL is ALL. I really want to evaluate my level of forgiveness to that I can get all of the forgiveness that I need!

But I can be too concerned about getting my own forgiveness, when God wants me to care about others just as much as myself. So, if my seeking forgiveness is mainly about me . . . I'm satisfied God wants much better than this > caring about "us", and "our" trespasses, not just my own.

Sometimes we hold on so tight to those feelings of guilt, like it makes us better.

I have found that I can guilt-trip myself in order to try to pay God off - - so I can get back to doing some pleasure sin, again and again and again, but then do-it-myself punish myself > this bashing my own self can be a trick to avoid how God would correct us effectively so the sinning stops.